Matewan Oral History Project Collection
Sc2003-135

Nel Nenni Interview

John Hennen: Check on mike one. Interviewers microphone. Check on mike two. Narrators microphone. Today's Wednesday, July 12. This is John Hennen for the Matewan Development Center preparing to conduct an oral history interview with Nel Nenni. Nel, Gentile Nenni in Nenni's Department store in downtown Matewan. It's approximately 11:15.

J: Okay.

Nel Nenni: I imagine you been in about ten floods.

J: Just in Matewan?

NN: Just in Matewan. No countin' I was in them in Williamson too. You know our business down there.

J: Okay.

NN: THere still gettin'' in them down there at that bottling company that we have.

J: Okay. Let me ask you...we'll start with some background questions and then we'll get into all that. Mrs. Nenni, would you please give me your...your full name before your marriage and when and where you were born.

NN: Nel...Nel Adell Gentile. I was a Gentile.

J; Okay.

NN: G.E.N.T.I.L.E. That's my maiden name.

J: ANd when and where were you born?

NN: I was born in Williamson, West Virginia.

J; Okay. And what year was that?

NN: Uh...1916.

J: Okay. And you moved...you later moved to Matewan in about 1937.

NN: 1937's when I got married.

J: Okay.

NN: ANd come to Matewan.

J: Okay.

NN: Course my husband had his eyes on me since I was four years old. Can you imagine that?

J: IN Williamson.

NN: In Williamson, see, my mother had a grocery store and she fed people when they'd come to Williamson cause it took them all day to come to Williamson cause it was all the muddy roads, see, and everything and when they'd come to Williamson, uh...they would stay at my mothers house. She kept...roomed them and we cooked for them. She had this great big kitchen behind the grocery, see.

J: Um-hum.

NN: So we would feed people back there and I think they'd charge them seventy-five cents to eat and I think a dollar to sleep or something like that in those days. It was very cheap and that's how I met my husband. He met me when he saw..saw me, he told my mother, said I'm gonna marry that girl when she gets big.

J: Now, what was he in Williamson for. Was he...

NN: Well, he came..he came here from Italy. My husband came from Italy.

J; Un-hun.

NN: And uh..he came when he was six years old. Him and his sister and his brother. Attilio Nenni. And uh...they would come to Williamson cause they had to come to buy groceries see. They would come and buy groceries from my mother and daddy. That's how we met them.

J; And they were buying groceries for their own use or did they have a store also?

NN: Yeah. For their own use. No. Just for their own use. THey come and buy all their groceries from us and stay all night then the next day, they'd come back up here and then they would come for other things because you had to come to Williamson because the court house was in Williamson. Everybody had to come and do their business in Williamson.

J: uN-hun.

NN: So that's how they would come a lot, you know, and a lot of times, he would have trouble. Have to go to court. My daddy would have to help him you know uh...with different things because his daddy couldn't speak English and all that.

J: Your husbands father?

NN: My husband's father yeah and uh...that's how we all got acquainted but I didn't know all of this was goin' on. My mother was tellin' me all this before she died, you know.

J: Was your husband uh...much older than you were?

NN: Yeah...he was about nine years older than me.

J: And his name was..let's get his name now.

NN: Attilio. A.T.T.I.L.I.O. was his name.

J: Now your...your parents ran a grocery and a...and a department store in Williamson?

NN: NO. We ran a grocery store. THat's how we started out.

J; Un-hun.

NN: And my great-great Uncle come over with my mother and daddy and he had an import-export thing...a business in there too. In this grocery store.

J; Un-hun.

NN: ANd he would send money over Europe you know, Italy and all over and he was very highly educated and uh...he was my great-great uncle.

J: What was his name?

NN: Joseph Quatro.

J: Okay.

NN: So that's how they started all those businesses then my...my great-great uncle goes first. They worked in the mines. I forgot to tell you about that first. They worked in the mines and then my uncle got gassed and that's why he went into this business. Import-export.

J: He was gassed in the mines?

NN: He couldn't work...Yeah, he was gassed in...he couldn't breath good and everything so that's why he went in import-export because that way he wouldn't have to go in the mines any more and he could help my mother with the boarders and they packed lunches. Get up four o'clock in the morning and fix about forty lunches for people you know, go to mines and all that. They did all that work in that kitchen and everything back in there.

J: Un-hun.

NN: So that's how we got started in Williamson with the grocery store then the import-export place and then uh..when the depression came, they couldn't carry on...they couldn't make it anymore down there and all that so after, I think it was in uh...oh, about ten or fifteen years later I imagine, daddy decided that the boys, they couldn't make a livin so we had all our family growin' up. It might have been twenty or thirty years later with all of them growin' up you know.

J; Un-hun.

NN: So, my daddy decided that he's gonna put in a bottling plant for the boys so he put in that business so they went out of grocery business and went out the import-export so they all went into this bottling business and then they...then...eventually, they put in beer. They put in a beer or two and that started that business so that we could make our livin and daddy built this big building on third avenue there and uh...it was twenty-one rooms and three tile bath. We still kept people in it you know, then daddy...daddy even did things on the side. Worked for railroad.

J: He had people as borders?

NN: Yeah. Yeah.

J: He still kept borders?

NN: We had borders on the third floor. We had twenty one rooms in that place and three tile baths and we girls did all the work and helped my mother cook everything from scratch you know, and everything and uh...we'd warsh clothes, we had to get up at four o'clock in he morning and do our washing. We'd have sixty shirts a week maybe to wash and iron. We had to iron you know. THey better not be a wrinkle in it. BAck in those days, we did all that see.

J: Did you have an electric iron by this time?

NN: NO. You had to heat those iron, you know, the old fashioned ones that you put them over there and heat them up. tHen you ironed you know and did all that and course we had to...we had to wash clothes on the board and I always washed clothes across from my mother and I always was the one to help her and my daddy had my other sister in help him in the office. She kept the books.

J: UN-hun.

NN: And he sent her to school and course she was goin' to school but when she graduated, daddy sent her to business school so she could help in that business., THat business is still there today in Williamson on third avenue.

J: Yeah. What's the name of the company?

NN: 7-up bottling company.

J: Okay.

NN: Mingo Bottling Company.

J: Was that the name of it when your...

NN: NO. THey..they called it something else and I can't remember cause we...when daddy started the business, why, daddy told, us said, all the girls now, you'll have to stay up all night tonight and help these boys get this business off the ground so that night we all stayed up all night and bottled pop and I drank pop all night long to this day, I can't drink a bottle of pop. (laughing) I can't look it in the face so we bottled and I fed the warshing. I had on rubber gloves and everything so we all worked all night long. Daddy said, well tonight, you all drink pop tomorrow's a business day. We don't drink pop now no more. So...so that's how we got the business started. THe girls helped the boys so the boys then, they start gettin'' out and each one had they designated job of uh...manage...one of them go out and get the orders and one of them would...one of my brothers was trained to work in the syrup room to make the pop an uh...syrup and everything. THey had a syrup room and it was all real sterilized and had these big bats up there we made this...Mavis. You ever heard the chocolate drink Mavis?

J: I don't think I've heard of that.

NN: Well, we made that. It was a chocolate drink. It was delicious and uh...we made all kinds of different kinds of drinks like that back in those days. It was hard to sell pop. You couldn't give it away.

J: Now is this probably in the 1940's your talkin' about?

NN: It must have been '40's or '50's.

J: Un-hun. Okay.

N: Later. Much later after everybody got big. THen daddy sent my oldest brother to college so he could get an education to help the other boys so we all tried to help each other in one way or another so.

J: Now how many brothers and sister were there?

NN: We had six girls and seven boys in the family and my mother had thirteen children. She never was in the hospital. Strong woman. She come from Italy and uh..my daddy too. They lived uh..across each other on a farm. They both live on a farm in Italy.

J: IN Italy.

NN: In Italy.

J: Yeah, tell me bout how they got over here.

NN: They lived in Italy and they couldn't make it over there because you had to raise your grains and everything to pay your taxes. To Mussolini and all that well, see, it got so that the ground wasn't no good. THey couldn't raise anything over there and they was, I think five in my mother's family. SHe was two girls and three..three brothers she had and um...so, the daddy told them that they was gonna have to make plans to get out of there and he wanted...and we were very close church people over there in Italy and my mother sang in the choir and everything and my daddy all of them and uh...so they told them that they was gonna have to get out of there because they couldn't make them a living, said, if one of the children stayed over there on the farm, said, that'd be all that could stay there. Said because, that's the only way they could make their living.

J: Um-hum.

NN: So that's when my mother uh..and my father fell in love. THey was on the next farm with each other so my daddy had the tickets to come to America, I don't know how many months and she was afraid to tell her mother about it. Cause she was afraid her mother wouldn't let her come. So they waited almost to the last minute to catch the boat you know to come over so uh...finally she got the nerve up to tell my mother and my grandmother and my grandfather and so, when she told them, they...they made arrangements for my great-great-uncle to come over here with them so that's how come he came over with them.

J: Her mother arranged for the great-great uncle to come?

NN: Yeah. To come with her and..and my father so he was supposed to come over in here America and put on their wedding and take care of her until she got married and put on a nice wedding which they did. THey had a big blow out.

J: Where was their wedding?

NN: For a week. THey celebrated for one solid week. Drinkin' and havin' food and everything in Williamson.

J: In Williamson?

NN: Right in Williamson and so they got married and that's how that all started you know and uh...so, let's see what else can I tell you about that part, then they come over on a boat and she was on...they were on seventeen day on the ocean and she got sick and she stayed down in the bottom cause she couldn't stay up in the top she said cause it would get sick and she never hardly ate for seventeen days. Her and her boyfriend and my uncle but he took care of them and they finally got over here and when they got over here, they went to the Northern part of he state. Up Elkins, West Virginia.

J; Um-hum.

NN: Well, when they went up there, we had some kin folks, the tobaccos, there all up in...you've seen their advertisements. THe Tobaccos up in uh...Davis, West Virginia and all up in there. Well, there all our cousins and things that lives up in there so they had a business up there. They had groceries and they had a bar up there and restaurant and all that stuff like my mother had down here. WHen they first went to Elkins and then it got so that the union came in there at the same things here so they had to leave because they had to make a livin for themselves and they couldn't stay up there anymore cause...

J: Was your father workin' in mines at that time?

NN: Up there.. Up there. Yeah. Up in Elkins. Yeah.

J: And the union moved in and called a strike. I that what happened?

NN: THat's it. THat's it and then they came back down here into...they came to Belfry, Kentucky is where they came to and they lived in some tents and things over there until the...the superintendent over there got them a big house and they kept boarders over there but it was all the people from my mothers hometown. She kept everyone of them when they were over there, she said it was very dangerous to live over there if they all had to guns and you had to have guns in your bedroom of the night cause of the night time, you might...had to protect yourself over there. It was dangerous. Very dangerous.

J: So the strike activity was goin' on there.

NN: Was goin' on in Kentucky, see so she said that uh....

J: So this is people from your mother's hometown in Italy.

NN: IN Italy. From there hometown but she had all these men with them that come from Italy and they were all over there so, so then it got so bad that my daddy decided that he wanted to get out of there because it was just too much trouble and they's afraid they was gonna get killed all of them. So then he come into Williamson and he got acquainted with the sheriff and the Hatfield and all them and uh...with Greenway Hatfield. What was the sheriff's name back then? I can't even think it's been so long.

J: He was the sheriff for awhile.

NN: Cause I can remember, when I's just a little kid and so they helped my daddy and all our family to come into Williamson and they helped him get that property on third avenue and showed him around and got him started and we bought the building there on third avenue and then they all moved to Williamson then. THat's how they got into Williamson then they started their grocery store.

J: WHo's them you mean...just your family or...

NN: THe Hatfields and...

J: Oh, Okay.

NN: And the...they...they kind of helped us out see and then my daddy was under...under cover detective too.

J; Is that right? For who?

NN: Yeah.

J: For Greenway Hatfield?

NN: Well, it was for Greenway Hatfield and them. That's when people would come in here and they was tryin' to get rid of them and things like that that uh...shouldn't be in this area that come over here and you know, they's a lot of mafia back then to you know and my daddy worked with the Hatfields cause...

J: He worked under cover to route out the mafia? To route out...would that be the black hand that you hear about?

NN: Well, we don't know see. We just surmised that's what it was but we wasn't sure but I think...

J: That's pretty dangerous business for him to be involved in.

NN: It was dangerous. That was dangerous but my daddy...my daddy..my mother cried day and night. She didn't want him to get...

J: She knew he was doin' this?

NN: SHe knew he was doin' it but she didn't know it for a long time and so when she told him, she's cried, she'd didn't want him to do it she said because he was gonna get killed cause she had all those kids. She had about five or six kids then.

J: Were you born in Williamson?

NN: Yeah. Born right in Williamson. Yeah. So, the Hatfields were close friends of ours and they would help us when we needed help and stuff like that.

J: Now, what sort of things would your father be called on to do as an investigator?

NN: Well, that was just if somebody, if they people that came in on the train you know, things like that and they knew them and they knew they were bad people. THey would make them go back. That's what they did to them. They wouldn't allow them in here see because they wanted this place to be a clean good place and people make a livin and not all that stuff that went on see.

J: So your father then, being a countryman of the people...

NN: Yeah, helped out.

J: Coming in would be set to find out what they were...

NN: Yeah. They'd go to the trains sometime, they would come get him and say, we want you to come to the train station, there's a bunch come in on the train and we want you to see who these people are see and sometimes, my mother, my uncle would know them if they were close around you know, where they live up there and they were bad people they would put them right back on the train and make them go back to New York and make them...ship them back out. Back home. They didn't want them over here see cause they didn't want that stuff to start cause people were starving bad enough. THey didn't need that kind of stuff over here so my daddy did a lot of good things like that to you know, to help out every place he could. He tried to help and do what was right. We...we were a very religious family and we...we stuck up for the flag of the United States. (laughing)

J: Now you mentioned earlier, that your mother never went in the hospital?

NN: NO, hun-un.

J: So she had all her children at home?

NN: She always had the doctor, Doctor Salton was our doctor. He delivered every one of us. You know Doctor Salton in Williamson, well his sons still living. They owned...they used to own the Williamson Memorial Hospital.

J: UN-hun.

NN: ANd when he'd come and deliver mommy's babies, he'd stay all night and they'd have a big feast and fix a meal, and they put all us kids to bed early so they...we wouldn't know what was goin' on you know. (laughing) back in those days.

J: WHat was your...when...when the babies were delivered, would your father be around assisting in the birth?

NN: OH, yeah. Yeah. My daddy would be right there and my uncle too. My uncle was real good at things like that. Did you also have a mid-wife come in or a nurse?

NN: Yeah. Well, if they needed it but Doctor Salton usually stayed all night. He stayed with us.

J: Hum.

NN: He was a very good doctor. He delivered every one of us. We had a good life in Williamson, we can't complain. We...

J: Now, all the boys and all the girls at one point or another, they were involved in the family bottling business and the grocery business?

NN: Oh yeah. They still are . They still run it. I have uh..my sister Lorraine Sherman and Helen Chambers, she uh...she's Helen Chambers is the head bookkeeper down there all still in the business. And it's all run by mostly the family. They work twenty-three people down there

J: Tell me something, you being in Williamson during the years of World War II.

NN: Yeah.

J: Was there any anti-Italian sentiment that came up...

NN: We had alot. Now, my sister could tell you more about that see, cause I left home when I was nineteen. I got married.

J: Un-hun.

NN: And my sister could really enlighten you on that because my oldest brother went in service, Tony Gentile and my...my brother Don Gentile went in the navy and uh..then I had another brother, he got killed they shot their plane down in Germany on the seventeenth mission and I had, let's see, there was three or four..let's see, three or four of my brothers in service at the time in the second World War yeah, both all...

J: But even with your brother's in the service, there was still some prejudice against Italians in Williamson?

NN: We still ran the plant. Oh yeah. There was then yeah. Oh, yeah. It...it's beginning to you know, people are beginning to accept you better now I think. They're beginning to understand that yo...you see that show on Matewan. Did you see that?

J: The movie?

NN: The movie.

J: un-hun.

NN: Alright you saw the part where the Italian people were in there and they wouldn't talk, well, in the...and you noticed the American women went and said they wasted that...that corn meal. You remember seein' that part?

J: Un-hun.

NN: Well, they didn't know that that woman didn't waste it. She made polinta, see and that...

J: Tell me what that is now.

NN: THat was the prejudice. That's corn meal...that's corn meal, you make that with corn meal and water. you boil it and cook it and then you make Italian sauce with it. Like we do spaghetti sauce out of ribs, but you make that out of ribs see and you put it over..over a dish..put it in a dish, pour it out the corn meal, like a corn meal and then you put the sauce on top of that. That's all it is. It's a corn meal. That woman didn't know what she was makin'. They didn't understand each other. That's why in this country we don't try to understand each other, that's why we have all these troubles. Nobody wants to get down and really get down to the nitty gritty and say, well, I didn't understand that. I'm gonna ask her what she meant by that. You know. We were always reluctant to talk to people and we were bashful and backward kid a that you didn't do things like that and you kind a felt bad because they knew more about America than you did and you're tryin' to learn see. (laughing)

J: Did...did uh...did your kids and your parents speak Italian exclusively in the home or did you switch over to English?

NN: No. My mother wouldn't speak Italian. She wanted us to speak American. SHe sent us to school she said she wants us to learn everything we can cause we're gonna be good Americans over and stand up for our country and be counted and that's what she brought...that's the way she brought us up. She said because once you learn a foreign language over there and you come over here and you talk a broken...you talk a broken English. Broken English, right.

J: Could you speak English by the time you started school?

NN: I never could speak Italian.

J: You never spoke any Italian?

NN: I never spoke Italian.

J: I be darn.

NN: I never did. ANd I never had...

J: So your father spoke English too then?

NN: But my daddy spoke both and my mother spoke both see, she didn't want us to because she was afraid we'd get our English all mixed up and everything and she said, she wanted us to keep learning everything we could because this was our country, we had nothing to go back to in Italy and this was our land, our country and we loved it. And we made our living here and we have been happy here. All of us everyone of us.

J: WHen you kids got sick, uh...did...were the doctors often called in...

NN: Yeah. Dr. Salton. We'd call Dr. Salton for everything.

J: Did your mom have any home remedies that she brought over from Italy?

NN: Well, yeah. I can't remember. SHe used cambell meal I remember that a lot you know, whenever you had...you were sick or something you would make this cambell meal like the tea. It's like a tea. It's in the stores now. YOu know what it is don't you?

J: Un-hun.

NN: Well, we drank that a lot to soothe your stomach and she carried, she used that to cure a lot of things.

J: It was king of an all purpose thing?

NN: That was an all purpose thing. (laughing)

J: When did your husband start actively, or the man that became your husband start actively courting you? I know he knew you as a child.

NN: Well, uh...he didn't come into the picture until, lord, when I was in junior high school, junior high and he started coming around and he'd been dating different people but he always came back to see me every time.

J: So you were in junior high, then he would have been eighteen or nineteen?

NN: Yeah. Something like that.

J: Something like that.

NN: Yeah. And I know he used to come around and see me and the girls would say...oh, you shouldn't be going with him. He's too old for you. You know different ones would say that but they'd say, he's good looking you know and all that you know, course I didn't pay any attention to it cause I didn't...my mother didn't allow us to date. She didn't allow us to go with boys and we weren't allowed in cars. SHe was very strict and we never went with anybody. He was the first one I ever went with.

J: He..was it necessary for him to call on you at home and...

NN: At the house. That was the customary thing. You had to come to the house and you had to set in the living room with the family.

J: Un-hun.

NN: And then, he came and ate dinner or supper with us and we'd all be together you know. That was the old customs that you didn't go in no cars or nobody's house. They came to your house and they came there and he quit about two or three times and I didn't see him for oh, quite a while then he got mad because my mother wouldn't give him any liberty to take me to the show or anything. SHe wouldn't do it. My daddy wouldn't either. THey were just very strict people cause they had thirteen kids and they was afraid and you couldn't blame them back in those days cause we didn't really know him that well see.

J; Did it help the situation any that he was also of Italian heritage. Was that important or not?

NN: Well, no. See, I come from a different part of Italy than he did. He came from near Rome someplace.

J; Un-hun.

NN: And you've heard the name Salmon well, that's where my mother come from. Salmon Italy.

J: Was that uh...

NN: And that's what ??????? were Birdsays and he's Romani, see, he come from a different...different town.

J; un-hun.

NN: See, there's different kinds, just like in West Virginia, we have different towns. Well, it's the same thing over there see. YOu have...and then, some people from the South, some from the North. But we call ourselves Buzzi's see and uh...have you ever been in New YOrk as you go down forty second street, you go in the somebody's Buzzi's well, that mean close to Samone, they came from Samone and they talk that foreign language. The dialect there.

J: Tell me how to spell those.

NN: B.U. let's see. B.U.Z.Z. isn't it B.U.Z.Z.I I think.

J: Okay.

NN: I thank now I'm not sure.

J; ANd how about...

NN: I'm not good on that spelling.

J: HOw about Salmon, I think.

NN: S.A.L.M.O.N. I think.

J: Okay. THat's what I thought.

NN: YOu'll find it on a map. It's close to Rome too.

J; Okay.

NN: BUt it's a little small...it's small...it's not a real small place you know. It's...now we have a lot of cousins over there still yet. Over in Salmon. They work for the government over there. We got some cousins over there but we...we don't know them. we don't know any of them but...

J: Okay. Now as your husband as your husband was courting, you said he quit courting you a couple times before he came back.

NN: Yeah. He came back every time then he'd kindly accepted it you know. He'd go out with other girls and he didn't like this one...he didn't like this one and he didn't like that one. HE didn't like the way they was raised and this and that and the other, you know. All that different stuff. THen all at once, he'd come back. One time he came time he came back and I was already engaged to somebody else. This is the one my mother really wanted me to marry cause he came from our hometown. But, but I didn't love him. I didn't love him and so Tilio...Tilio came back then and um...1936 and I was comin' out of high school and I was gonna graduate from high school and he came up to the high school and uh..came up to see me and that's the first time I'd seen him in about two years and he said, he came up to see me. He wanted me to ride with him in a car and I told him I couldn't...I couldn't do it so he just stayed up there and talked with me a little while and he left and then I didn't see him then till after...after I graduated and then I saw him and uh...he came down to my mother's house and my older brother Joe was down stairs and he told Joe to come up stairs and get me said, you go up stairs and get your sister, now, said I want to talk to her so I come down stairs and he said, well, he said, I can't stand this no more, he said, let's you and I run away. I said, no, I can't do that...my mother and daddy wont speak to me rest of my life.

J; Were you still engaged to this other guy at this time?

NN: Yeah. I was engaged to him and I's still engaged to him and he got all mad because I was even seeing him but I really liked him the best, Tillio.

J: Tillio.

NN: But I really liked him the best. I always liked him and uh..so he said, uh...I told him I said, no, the thing you got to make up your mind...you got to make up your mind that you have to talk to my mother and daddy and come upstairs and lets work this all out and plan it out and they'll give us a real nice wedding and they'll probably buy us our furniture and everything. I said, you don't know how lucky you are and so then he...then he settled down then and then started comin' and visiting my mother. And so my mother didn't like it cause I broke up with this other guy and I told him that I just didn't love him and my mother was tryin' to put us together, see. Back in those days, that's what they did. They put the families together you know. Anybody had anything or same nationality or...the same little town, well they would put them together back in those days and that's what my mother was doin' to me and I didn't like it but I...I didn't have the face enough to tell her that I didn't love him but I was too bashful and too ashamed to tell her so finally, I...my oldest sister, she had been married and she had three children and she come back home so one night, she asked me, she said to me she says "Nel, I got to ask you a personal question." She said "I been wantin' to ask you for a long time..." Says "Do you really like this boy that your engaged to?" I said "No, not really." I said "Mother's putting me together with that." She says "You give me that damn diamond ring." She said and "You give me that damn diamond watch you got and I'm stickin' in the damn post office in the mornin'. You're not marrying that boy." She said, "Cause you're gonna come back home just like me with three kids." She said "If you don't love that guy, you ain't got no business goin' with him."

J: Had she has trouble with her marriage?

NN: She had a divorce. SHe had a divorce and had to come back home with three kids and uh...my mother treated her like she was us then. SHe couldn't go out anymore and all that stuff again. SHe didn't allow it and uh...so the next day, after I'd mailed that back, here come my boyfriend with his uncle and he was upset and he brought another big diamond and I don't know what all he brought wantin' me to marry him and I told him, "No", that I decided that I...I didn't really love him and I had the nerve to stand up and tell him and I don't know where I got it, but I did and so, he...

J: So your sister kind of pushed you over the edge I guess.

NN: That's what she did because she had experience and I didn't see and so my sister told me, if you don't stand up for what's right, said, your gonna suffer like me and you're gonna come back home with kids. And said "You don't want to come back home cause you see how you have to live. Mother makes you stay in the house all the time, you can't go no place. YOu can't do nothing. YOu have to stay in here and take care of your kids and slavin' in her and everything you know and we had borders then too. ANd uh..so I listened to here cause I knew she had experience and she's suffered and everything and I knew what she had been through to... through her marriage and everything so I told her I said well, I said, I'll tell him if he comes around. I'll stand up for what I believe in now so I...I was the type that I couldn't speak up for myself. I was always back you know. I wouldn't talk but I...I got the nerve then to tell him and I was glad I did because I knew later years I would have had lot of trouble and I had to have a divorce because he wasn't the type that...that was....that would go along with my personality and everything the chemistry just didn't mix. He was one of these bull dozers, you know what I mean. One of those bully types.

J: Aggressive.

N: He'd keep you under all the time you know, and every once in awhile, push down on you and all that and I realize that after about ten years and I look back on it and I thought what a damn fool I was. I couldn't see that.

J: Did he marry later?

NN: Yeah. He married but this girl that he married she... they... they come from a well to do family then he married and they put that together too. They put together...and that woman has been tryin' to put that together all the time he was goin' with me, she was tryin' to break us up see, she was tryin' to put him together with her so now, they live in Florida. They're Millionaires.

J: um-hum.

NN: They had a farm...they had a big farm and the government came in and gave them alot of money and then she came into a lot of money with her aunt and now they're retired in Florida and he's got seven kids. (laughing)

J: What was your father's role...

NN: And his name was Tilio Neal too.

J: OH, is that right? (laughing)

NN: My father told me, he kept telling me all the time you better watch what you do cause you didn't want to get in trouble. That's all he would say but that's all he would say. He wouldn't say nothing.

J: He was kind of on the sidelines?

NN: Yeah, he was on the sideline and my oldest brother, my brother Tony, he was well educated. He would tell me, He'd say, Well, Nellie, it's your life, said I'm just coming here and talking to you cause mommy made me to said, she wants you to make up with Tillio Marconi. His name was Marconi and I said, well, I don't want to. I don't want to make up with him. I'm not in love with him. And said I don't want no part of him and I want that part out of my life so he said, "Well, I'm just in here cause mommy made me come in here to talk to you" and he tried to make him think that mommy...she was on his side you know an all that. But he wasn't. He was trying to see what was good for me.

J; Un-hun.

NN: And he understood that my mother wouldn't understand cause she...she was like that. She wanted you to marry him and that was it.

J: THat brings up and interesting point with me, what was the uh...how strict were your parents with the boys. Were they just as strict with the boys as they were with the girls?

NN: My daddy took care of the boys and my mother took care of the girls. Very strict. THey couldn't go out or anything. ONe of my brothers...he was a...loved to go to dances cause they all danced you know. loved the music and everything and so my daddy, one...he told him he couldn't go to the dance so my daddy took all his clothes and locked them up in there in a trunk so he couldn't go to the dance one night and you know what he did? He got one of his summer pants like this and it was in December, snow on the ground and he went to the dance. ANd when he came back, his dad punched him see. Yeah. He was very strict with them. THat's why he kept them under control so they wouldn't get in trouble in Williamson and uh...he.. he always knew everything they did. He always helped them in anything...anything...if they had trouble or anything or if they got in trouble, he was right there with them and he tried to have a good life with them, a good home and they helped at home too. Worked hard...all of them worked hard and...

J; Did the uh...

NN: We all stuck together.

J: You mentioned your father's work for I guess for Greenway Hatfield earlier.

NN: Yeah.

J: As sort of their undercover...now later on, did the...the so called blackhand or the...

NN: NO. Hun-hun.

J: GEt any kind of a hold in there?

NN; No, they didn't. THey didn't. See, it was just a minor thing you know, to keep watch. THat's all that was so that they wouldn't have no trouble.

J: Um-hum.

NN: Within this country.

J: Okay. Now you and Tillio, did you get married shortly after you were in high school?

NN: 1937. RIght after I graduated from high school.

J; Okay.

NN: Yeah.

J: And at that time was he involved in family business here in Matewan?

NN: He was involved with the Nenni family.

J: Un-hun.

NN: Very involved. Worse than I was and uh...they had this business, he run the whole thing. He did the buyin', the sellin', the bookkeeping, and he done it all.

J: It was a department store at that time?

NN: It was a department...well they started out with a shoe shop fixin' shoes with his daddy and eventually, they built up into a department store with the shoe shop see and his sister went in with him and they all...his family was in that see in here.

J; In this same building?

NN: In the same building and we all...they all worked together so he worked for his daddy is what he did when we got married.

J: Had the shoe shop been in this building also?

NN: oH yeah.

J: Was it in this building?

NN: Yeah. It was in this... it was in the basement at that time. THey had it down...goin' downstairs in the basement part and the upstairs, they had a store. THey...they eventually went into a store. THat's how we spread out see, like that. Kept it goin' that way and kept building and addin' to it and addin' things but they first went...they put in shoes and hose and bags and things like that, well they couldn't make it with just three little things like that so then they start adding the merchandise.

J; UN-hun,.

NN: CAuse the more you make you know, sometime you can make a sell over here and one over there and then its different all around the store that way, you can make your livin better.

J: NOw, when you...and when you married Tillio and you got involved in the business I guess also at one time?

NN: RIght. Right. Right.

J: Were you...were you still in competition with company stores at that time?

NN: WHat you mean...

J; Were you still in competition with the mining companies stores?

NN: OH yeah...yeah...yeah. We always were cause we kept adding things like work clothes. We kept gettin'' in competition with them and that's how we kept growing see and growin' all the time and uh...then some of his sisters got married. They didn't work with them anymore and eventually uh...I...when Eddie was born, why, we bought the store off of the mother and the daddy see. We bought it off of them and that was.. oh, God, let's see, Eddie was about three years old I think when we bought the store off them and then they moved to Huntington because they,..all their kids were goin' to college and they wanted to go down Huntington to be wasy (?) on John and his wife cause they could stay home and go to college down there.

J: THey were all goin' to marshall?

NN: So they were all goin' to Marshall and...and one of the boys is a doctor. Dr. Nenni. In Ironton, Ohio. Have you heard of him?

Dr. Harry Nenni. Well, that's Tillio's brother and he had and then one of his brothers worked at Huntington Herald Dispatch. Johnny Nenni.

J: Um-hum.

NN: And Rudy Nenni, now he lives in Middletown Ohio and he had a printing place of his own. He works about twenty-three people in his place. So they're all been in business and uh...Rose Nenni, she uh...she had a beauty shop and I think she still has a beauty shop in her house down Huntington. (laughing)

J: SHe...she lives in Huntington?

NN: SHe lives in Huntington. Do you remember her?

J: I've never met her but I've heard the name, yes.

NN: You've heard of her. Yeah...yeah. She has...still has the beauty shop and they's a big...and then she had one sister worked in Middle...let's see, in Ohio there. I can't think of the name of the town. Georgia was a Home Ec teacher. THey all got their degrees and Georgia taught in Ohio and then she married a boy up there that...a big fam...in a big family on a farm and they...they-..they have two nice boys. They're doctors. And they moved to California. They're retired now and uh...Anna Nenni, she taught at Riter College, New Jersey in a business college so they all went to college. THey got their degree's cause they suffered so much back when they were little. THat's all they was worried about gettin' their college degrees.

J: THey all went on through huh?

NN: All went on through and they all...and Rudy Nenni, he went to Military school and he graduated and he's the one that's go that place in Middletown, Ohio. Oh, he sold his place out to his boy and his boy's runnin' that place down there. He's doin' a great job so he...they were up here. THey're gonna come back for the fair when the fairs on. THey're gonna come back. All of them are gonna come back and visit because, Lord, they know all these mountains and Rudy, when he was a little boy, they'd go to the mountains with boy scouts and all that stuff. They know every rock and every turn on that mountain. THey can tell you everything about this place. (laughing) And I get tickled when they come...they have to go around and visit all...everybody that's been here that they knew when they were growin' up you know and they have to get all their friends and everything and it's really interesting to listen to all of them, you know, what they went through when they were little.

J: Um-hum.

NN: THey went through some terrible times. They had it tough too, plenty tough before they got started in business.

J: Um-hum.

NN: ANd then they start feeding their family and everything. STart goin' little bit smooth but still you have to work hard everyday. YOu can't give up. You can't quit.

J: Yeah. WHat was uh...when you first got married, what was the business climate like in town at that time? Was it pretty rough?

NN: Oh, it was good then.

J: Oh, was it?

NN: When I got married, business was good. And it was building up good and uh...after we moved out of this apartment up here and we went to Charleston, we moved away. We moved away and Tilie got a job in Charleston and broke up with the family and we had trouble. WE had family trouble so we went to CHarleston and he got a job in twenty-four hours, he had a job.

J: Um-hum.

NN: ANd uh...so we only....they stayed down there about three months and they kept begging us to come back and wanted him to run the store.

J; Um-hum.

NN: ANd so uh..he told...I told them that I wasn't goin' back unless they sold it cause my daddy told me he'd go on by bank note and he'd help us out, get us goin' so he told the mother that he'd sell us the store that we would come back. THat's how come we came back. Other wise, we wudn't gonna come back cause we had to much family trouble and too much...too many to try to get along with and it was just too hard on him then he had nervous breakdowns and he couldn't take it anymore so I...

J: this is Attilio?

NN: Yeah, Tilio had these nervous breakdowns. He had about four.

J; Um-hum.

NN: ANd uh..so uh..he uh...then we finally came back. When we came back then we took the store over..

J: Now, was..was Eddie born by that time?

NN: Let's see, what year was that. Yeah, Eddie was three years old when we left. He was just talking and everything. Just real cute you know and uh...we moved to Charleston and then when they said that that was Okay. That one of the boys would come and take inventory with Tilie and uh...they would sell us...sell us the store so then my daddy said go ahead, I'll help you everything you need, said, so my daddy went on my notes and things and helped me out so Tilie was tickled so we could have our own life. We didn't have to listen to all that because he was runnin' the family business. The whole family and he was involved in everything and he had no time to stay home. He was a nervous wreck all the time and I just couldn't take it. I just couldn't take it and so we just had to split up. There was no way for us to get along and so when we finally came back, they sold us the place then everything calmed down so we went down to the lower end of the town there. THat's were we bought, you know that big...did you know that two-story brick house was on the corner there, the railroad crossing. Do you ever remember seein' it there?

J; Hum?

NN: Before you cross the crossing?

J: Oh, yes.

NN: I had a ten room house there and five baths in that house. Well, mu husband Tillio, he helped build that house He put on the hard wood floors down. He helped..he done everything perfect in that house. THe plumbing, everything, We had it just fixed up beautiful well, we built a cottage first. A little cottage on the end. You remember that little white house was on the end, well, we had that first and then we rented that after so many years, we got the notes down, we paid down on everything and struggled and then we paid that off and then we built the big brick house, see. Then that's when we built the big brick house and so...so when we built the big brick house, they had all theses strip minings in here and things were booming in here and I mean booming so my husband...

J: Would this be say in the 1950's probably? Or later than that?

NN: Yeah. I believe it was round in the 50's.

J; Okay.

NN: ANd things were booming and they had all these people coming into town and no place to stay so we got the idea when we built that house we'd put the third floor on it so I rented rooms. I rented twenty-two rooms. And uh...and I...every week, they would sleep at our house. THey didn't want to go to Mountaineer cause they didn't want to spend all that money down there so we...we roomed them but they were all real nice people bookkeepers, executives and all that.

J; Un-hun.

NN: And so we had a real nice home and...

J: And you feed them also?

NN: No, we didn't feed them we...my husband got one woman to go in business over here next door at Irene Staten was her name and she fed all of them and she did a good business right here next door and we were doin' good you know and uh...so we...we had these roomers up there and when my husbands was takin' them up to...to rent them a room, he said, well, Mr. Nenni, don't you think that's a little high. I think you're chargin' thirty-five dollars or something like that for a week and he said, well, I got robbed before you did you know. (laughing) He said, I got to pay for this house. How am I gonna pay for this house if you're gonna come here and stay so finally they...they all moved in and we had... coming and going...we had people meetin' in our house from Chicago and New York, that hadn't seen each other in ten years. And they met in our house. They were doin' this kind of work they traveled all over the United States.

J; Now, these were mostly people who were gettin'' involved in the strip mining operation?

NN: Mining. Strip mining. THey were all hired and made big money. They all made big money and they stayed n our house and they'd go home on weekends to Pennsylvania and different places and uh...but we had our house full all the time then we had some neighbors across the river, the Bowlings, they had a brick home over there and I think they were having some kind of trouble too about there gettin'' there money in to pay their bills. THey said, Mrs. Nenni, said if you get too many, send them over to me so I'd send her over what I couldn't handle see, so...so we did real well and that's how I bought...paid for that house. Just by keepin' roomers and uh...

J: Were these folks from Island Creek coal or just all different places?

NN: No. All different companies. All different kind of strip mount...strip mining outfits and everything that came in here to set up...to make money. I don't know where they were working but they all had nice cars and nice clothes and had money. THey's making big money and the town was booming and they trade in town and they really had good business in this town when they did all that you know, bringing all these people in and so then finally the strip mine quit and course we was tired too because I think..I don't know if I had it about four or fives years and I was tired. I couldn't stand no more. You now, keeping roomers. (laughing) so I kindly gave it up then cause we didn't have the bank notes like we had and we got our bank notes down everything, paid the banks nd everything we owed them and so then I quit and I come up here and I started out, that's when Tilie takin' to gettin'' sick and i had to help him them and he turned the books over to me and I had to help him then so we quit because we had our house paid for then and everything was rockin' like the way we wanted it you know. (laughing) So...

J: Did...did you deal through the bank here in town?

NN: Matewan National BAnk. Yeah. Yeah. We always did. All our business there. The Nenni's did too, in fact, we've traded with them seventy years.

J; Um-hum.

NN: Seventy years we've been doin' business with them and they've always tried to help you in every way they could. Back in those days, they'd do anything to help you, to make you satisfied and do things everything was nice and we enjoyed staying here. That's why I'm here today. Because they been so good to us.

J: And this...this was...the bank was at that time, pretty much under the charge of the Chambers I guess?

NN: Yeah. Dan CHambers. Yeah. Dan and his wife, his wife helped him and the bank then was down on this corner. They...that's where they started out. Right in there. That little tiny place.

J: Um-hum.

NN: IN there and uh...they did great. Now, they helped the people they really helped the people. I can say that. THey were good to people.

J: Was there any other uh...department store type stores in Matewan or...

NN: Oh, yeah. We had all kinds. We had about five or six back when that started out. There was Kirk's Department Store, Hopes Department ...Hopes, I believe, they went in about the same time the Nenni's did and they started out with everything too. They had everything in there's too. And they did good business too. THey did real well too here in Matewan and uh...they had about five or six stores all the time. One...they was always somebody here cause there was business her all the time cause people hate to go to Williamson cause you go to Williamson, it was a hassle to go to Williamson and have to stay all night and come back the next day so they...when I got here and then the Buskirk building when they built that, that really made the town too over here. tHat was uh....my husband said that that place all the downstairs part was a dining room you know. THe people come in with wagons and uh...horse you know, and all that and they had a stable out the back and they would come in that back there and stay there all night and eat and stay in there and they...that place was full all the time. THey had a big bar in there. Big restaurant in there. THey had a big grocery...they had groceries in there. THey had everything in there. Over there too. Just like over on this other side if the street. but they started out in a big way you know...

J; Um-hum.

NN: Over across the street but uh...it always was a...keep thriving town. Always...everybody fightin' to try and make it better you know. Tryin' to make it better.

J: Was Attilio living here already by the time the Buskirk building was built?

NN: Well, he was just a little boy then. He...he told me that story about his family.

J: So his father had the shoe shop at that time?

NN: Yeah. That's when his daddy had a shoe shop and the Buskirks, they had that over there and he told it when he was a little boy. He heard all this stuff about how they did over there and he loved to go over there because they had steamed heat and they didn't have steamed heat over here. They was freezin'.

J: Steam heat in the Buskirk?

NN: In the Buskirk Building. They had radiators and all that and they didn't know what they were for a long time. They'd go over there and touch them you know and everything and they had steam heat over there and they'd had steam heat over there. THey'd go over there and warm up and he'd go over there. I think sometime, clean up or do something over there just to get in the building to warm up you know. They'd do things like that cause it was a really nice building. THat was something cause it was a really nice building. That was something to build back in those days in a town like this you know. ANd course, then you knew the CHambers and the Buskirks, they were inner married. You knew that didn't you.

J; I think so, yeah.

NN: See, Dan Chambers married one of the...the Buskirk girls and their...their baby died. It fell through the fire escape or something over there and it died.

J; Is that right?

NN: Little baby. Un-hun. Yeah. I remember Tillio tellin' about that too cause he knew all the new of the town. (laughing)

J: Was..

NN: It was something back in those days I imagine.

J: Was Tillio in town the day of the...the battle? The massacre?

NN: Oh yeah. Well, he told me a many a time that, you know, they had a bakery...they were...they had a bakery...his mother run the bakery and then they run a shoe shop too cause back then you had to bake your own bread and everything see.

J: What building was the bakery in?

NN: Well, it was...it is still over there. THat old stone building over there that's got those big windows. THey...that's all the Nenni's lived there. All up..

J: Is that...

NN: That side.

J: Is that the building that's vacant right now. That they...

NN: NO. It's not vacant. There's...they got it rented. THey tried to sell it to Attilio and they wanted him to have it but he didn't want it. He was too sick to...to fool with it cause he was takin' treatments and all that and we just couldn't handle anything more so uh...he didn't want it so he sold it to John McCoy. John McCoy had it. He rents it. John McCoy had it.

N: HIs mother ran the bakery?

NN": The bakery. And all the family did. WHat they'd do, they'd stay up...they'd get up about..they put this bread, it had to raise, you know, about four o'clock in the morning and Tilio said they..they slept on a flour sack's back there and said when the bread would stop raisin, it would be close to them and wake them up and that's when they would do the bread.

J:That's when they'd know to bake it huh?

NN: They knowed to bake the bread and he had to go out in the morning and sell the bread up and down the road and he would go with the...he had a model-t Ford and he would go around selling that bread see. And uh...what was so funny I have to tell you this funny part, his uncle come over from Italy and he didn't know how to speak english you know, and so when his uncle would uh...tell him about to go with him to help him with the bread, instead of him sayin' a hot bread. He would say hod a bread and they couldn't sell no bread that day and he couldn't figure out what happened you know, he'd say hod a bread for sale. He said broken English you know and everything and so Tillio said no wonder said, hell, you're goin' around saying hod a bread, you're supposed to say hot bread. laughing)

J: Nobody wanted that hard bread.

NN: So he said that day they didn't do no business you know sellin' bread and everything but said they sold a lot of bread and then see...

J; Just in town or did they go out of the coal camps too?

NN: Yeah. THey went all up town. Up in town and they'd go in that they had a Model-T. He went and collected shoes back then for his daddy you know, in the shoe shop. He'd collect all the shoes...all up and down the hollers and uh..up Red Jacket, they use to have a little place they call little Italy up there well,he'd go up there and he...he'd practically stay half a day cause they'd have....want their shoes fixed and he'd have to get them stuff at the store here and stuff. He'd take orders for clothes...work clothes and all that stuff and then he'd fill orders and he'd come down here and he'd have to bring their shoes to...him and his daddy would get up at four o'clock in the morning. Can you imagine to fix shoes. They'd get up four o'clock in the morning and be fixin' all them shoes and you know, back then, you didn't have these machines. Everything was by hand and their hands was like leather. WAs that...that yours?

J: Hun-un.

NN: Is that the door...pick em up.

J: Un-hun,

NN: ANd uh...they had to pick all the shoes up and bring em up and that's how they made their livin see between that bakery and shoe shop. ANd they struggled a plenty.

J: Did the Italian community at that time pretty much...did they stick together and did business back and forth with each other.

NN: They did. They did. They all tried to help each other and that's the way they did in Williamson too cause we had a lot Italian things in Williamson. The Venturino was in...Lord let's see, The Hagee's down there. THere's all kinds of them in Williamson. Walters, why we all stuck together. Everybody helped each other where you could get this...where you could get that and or somebody was growing something you didn't have, they'd bring it to you and all that. WHy, yeah. ANd give them clothes and pass clothes around and do things for each other, why yeah. We always did.

J: Was their a priest in Matewan?

NN: Yeah. Catholic well, no we didn't have one in Matewan. They didn't have one in Williamson. Lord, I don't guess that church came there until maybe 1916 in Williamson and their was a bunch started it in Williamson. THat's how it got there. They came... they came in from other cities thought, that started it see.

J: Um-hum.

NN: Then the priest came there. Yeah. We had a priest there but uh...it was way late after my mother come to Williamson.

J: How bout in the...in the camps around here, where there any Catholic services connected at all?

NN: No. Didn't have no Catholic services.

J: Okay.

NN: You had to go to Protestant church if you wanted to go and a lot of Italian people went just to go to church.

J: Now, did you say Tillio was downtown the day of the massacre?

NN: yeah. Oh, yeah.

J: Did he ever tell you anything about that?

NN: And he was tellin' about when the trains went by. He said the trains went by here on these tracks and they had uh..you know, just like the hills come down of course these building weren't this good then, you know, they was more ground more dirt, more trees and things and he said that when the train went, but he saw the train comin', they saw them stickin' the guns out the windows. They shot anybody that was on the street. Anybody and they had to hide under the ground here and so he was just a kid and said he saw I don't know how many shot and then they swept all the bodies up on a car a nd all that and he said it was terrible. It was a terrible thing to see. For a kid to see. And I think that worked on him all his life. He talked about that a lot. I think that a lot of times, he...he went back to a lot of the stuff that scared him to death. And made him have his nervous breakdowns. I'll always say that.

J: You think that contributed to his breakdowns?

NN: I think so. I really do because every time he would go off, his mind went back like that. It'd go back like that cause he had...they had such a hard life.

J: Now when...when he would have his breakdowns, would he have to go away to be hospitalized?

NN: Yeah, I had to take him away. I had to take him to...to Radford. See, they didn't have no hospital back then uh...for that when we...he first had the first one, and that's when the World War II started and that's when they started...they opened that place up at Radford. The King brothers run that and Radford, Virginia and uh...I went to the hospital on the hill. Dr. SAlton, they called up and they got the place for me and everything and so we took him on the train. We took him in the ambulance first time he was so bad. We had to take him in an ambulance course I was expecting another baby and I couldn't go but his sister took him and he went in the ambulance with them and uh..see the train wouldn't go through there by then. They just backed the train up into Radford, back in those days and uh..they took him and when he first had that first one and i will always say it went back to when he was a child. THat..he always went back to that. I think they suffered something terrible back then so what can you do. Do the best you can.

J: WHen he was in the hospital...

NN: He had...yeah, he had electric shock treatment.

J: Is that right?

NN: He had to have them yeah. Cause back then, they couldn't give you any medication. It's the only thing they could give you. See, that damages your brain too, you now that don't you? And uh..so he had to have them though cause he couldn't come home if he didn't but he would be real quite when he come home. He wasn't violent or anything like that and I could handle him good. I could talk to him. He was real nice. THen he'd get real good. He'd come back in here and work. He just worked and so then when the floods came, and we lost everything, this last seventy-seven flood.

J; Seventy-seven?

NN: He had...he completely went out again so I had to take him to Columbus. I took him up there cause it was closer. My daughter lives up there and i could stay with here too see. So we took him up there and he stayed up there about uh...we left here in April, when the flood, April, May, June, July, August, and Eddie got the contract here and he got this place goin' and I backed him up and i told him do what you have to do here and the SBA backed us up and we got the notes and everything so we started and...and I told Eddie I said, "You call me if you need any help and if you can't make any decisions, call me and we'll talk it over on the phone." ANd i said "I got to stay down here with your daddy 'til we get him better" cause he didn't want to come back anymore.

J: After the floods?

NN: Yeah. After the floods he didn't want to come back because he just tired of it. He just had too much. So they took us till October to talk him into comin' back so I lived...we lived with eight different families during the flood. Different ones when we was moving, you now. Gong her and goin' there.

J: Was your house wiped out?

NN: Everything was wiped out. This was wiped out. You couldn't even get in the apartments or nothing here. It was up...up to the ceiling. We had nine feet filled...See, they've lowered this since we had it remodeled. They've lowered it down but uh...let's see now, where was it back uh...when we kept talking to him. Everytime I would go down there I'd go to the psychiatrist and talk and everything and I'd ask how he was feeling and he said, "well, it's gonna take awhile to get him straightened this time." Said "WE just have to have patience with him and keep." Said "it's gonna take longer than it ever has." It was six months we was down there well, finally, I got him into the mood...Hiddy, (Hello) How you Eddie?

EN: (third party talking. Eddie Nenni.) Just fine, how you doin'?

NN: Pretty good. I got him into the mood that he wanted to come back and see it so he came back to see it. When he came back to see it, he felt pretty good about it and everything and I said "well, we're gettin'' everything straightened up." I said, "You won't have to do anything like you used to." I said, "We got it all done and we got all these nice carpenters and bricklayers and...and we bricked up all these backs" cause they used to be windows, they used to break in so we had it all bricked out. We done all kinds of plans here to cut this out cut that out, you know, and without a lot of work you know so it would be easier on him and we brought this shoe shop down stairs, it used to upstairs and we put it back there but he never did like that. He like that upstairs just having it...the little stairway goin' upstairs to his shoe shop, you know, he never liked it but Eddie got in there and started...

J: He'd still repair shoes?

NN: Yeah. He start repairing shoes then and he didn't do very much but he done little things. I said...no, he wanted to stay in Huntington and get a job. He can't get no job. His...the routine would kill him cause he'd go right back into a breakdown again but he...the more I tried to explain, you know, you couldn't explain nothing to him so I told him, I said, "No, you know why you have to go back home?" I said "You have to go back home because you can do what you want to." I said, "If you want to fix shoes, you can fix shoes, If you don't want to, you don't have to."

J: Um-hum.

NN: "Cause Eddie's there. You taught him how to do it and he can do it and he can help you." And I said "If you want to go to work, you can go to work, if you don't want to got work, you don't have to. You don't have any obligation to do anything." And I said"That's what you need. You need to retire now and you don't need to do but what you want to do. If you want tog et a car...get in a car and go down and Williamson and walk all day, I want you do it....do it...do it." ANd so I just kept talking to him like that and finally, I got him talked into it but he was mad. He didn't want to come back so finally I got him going and we got somebody moved out one of the three roomed apartments upstairs so I took him with me down at the B & L and bought some furniture right down there and got just what I need. Just a refrigerator, stove, a breakfast set and bedroom suit and rugs and I had them come put in wall to wall rugs and we really had it painted up and fixed and he really liked it. He enjoyed it you know, because he didn't have to do nothin' you know and I said "You don't need to do nothing. You're not supposed to do nothing. You're retired. You work hard all your life now it's time for you to quit and enjoy what you want to do." So we moved in that three room apartment and he really like it and he got so he came down then, he'd start workin' and movin' and doodlin' and before you know it, he got all involved in the store again and he really liked it and so then we...

J: So he and Eddie and you then, were runnin' the store.

NN: We all three run it together see and I'd cook upstairs and Eddie'd come up and eat lunch with me and he was married. He lived on Hatfield Bottom see. He got the flood too you know and uh...so we all worked together and we got it all back together before we know it and we had our business back up there, in fact, we did more business then than we ever done in our life, but now this thing has gone all he way to the bottom.

J: Business is bad now?

NN: Oh, it's terrible up here. We just don't have the people up here. We don't have people workin' up here. We don't have people. You got people..young people walkin' the streets ain't got no jobs. that's pitiful. They need to take them off them welfare and give them jobs. That's what these young people need. THey don't need all that stuff. That's what I think. Don't you? To make the place go like it once did so if you don't, the town ain't never gonna build up. Pep up and perk up. Well, if it wasn't for the bank, none of us would be here. You know that cause it wouldn't be no town cause they make the town, really, and they...they put on a lot of nice things that help the merchants in doin' this and workin' with us and everything. And it's just wonderful to stay here. BUt you couldn't stay without them. THEre's no way you could stay here if you couldn't make it cause my people's always beggin' me to quit and shut up and come on down there and stay with them and come down the office and work. Come down there and cool down said. I said, I"m stayin' up here with Eddie and helping him.

J: Where'd they want you to come?

NN: THey want me to come down to the plant. Down to the 7-up bottling plant.

J: Oh, Okay.

NN: Se, they want me to go back o the old home place and help them and be with them and not work as hard as I'm doin' you know, and everything but I don't want to because Eddie helped me and I'm tryin' to help him get is life goin and i want him to have this store if something happens to me see. Now, I want him to have it and make his living here and cause he likes it here and just family likes it so...see why not. he helped me. I'm helping him. And anything he needs so I...

J: It's that Italian background?

NN: That's Italian background. You know that. (laughing)

J: NOw, you had another...another child besides that?

NN: Yeah, Gerry Nell, she lives in Columbus.

J: Columbus, Okay.

NN: SHe's supervisor of a preschool down in Columbus and her husbands in business. He's a CPA. You know uh...Claude Maynard?

J: No.

NN: You don't know him. He used to be a railroad detective. Gerry Nell married his son. Do you know Richard Aliff used to be a watch call it at the A & P.

J: I know the name.

NN: You know the name. Well, his wife is Jimmy Maynard's sister. THey're kin folks. THey live in Williamson...they've lived in Williamson all their life too and they grew up like we did in Williamson all the Maynard's and we've known them. They're nice people. Real nice people.

J: Now, Mrs. Nenni, I've heard that Matewan was pretty booming town. Even...even what some people call a wide open town in the fifties.

NN: In the fifties.

J: Lot of recreation, movies, gambling, beer halls all those kinds of things.

NN: Yeah. See, Frank Allara went in over here at this theater and oh, you talk about the movies, we had them over here and his town was loaded, you know, people goin to the show on Saturday and Eddie used to go to show for ten cents and get popcorn for five cents right over here across the street. That woman, you see that store over there, that R-house?

J: Oh, yeah.

NN: That's where the theater was. That's why those little windows were up there cause that's where the movie was shown...picture thing upstairs right there and I used to live up here in this apartment over here and we just go across the street to the show see. Oh, yeah. It was a booming town and they made money around here too. Always did and it...they always had plenty of work back in those days and plenty money goin back in those...course Dan chambers helped the town, let's face it. Now, listen, when he would come around to the merchants, he'd tell us now, "Don't you all get upset now, because this week, this mine ain't gonna work or this one's down or this one or he'd tell you all the history you know of different things.

J; Um-hum.

NN: And he would keep the merchants to keep from worrying you know and all that when things were tough. When we all had these bank notes you know and everything and he would kind of help us out and then he'd come in and he'd even stir up things and he'd get people to come in and say "Well, you should go to Matewan and buy some things up in Matewan." And he'd do things like that you now, help everybody out and he was a great guy now. I tell you , he was. We miss him. Really do miss him now, I tell you. We really miss him. ANd he'd always gave you good advice. Very good advice and he'd tell you where you wouldn't get in trouble and he knew the laws and all this you know, he was kind of...what would you say, the law maker of the place, you know and...

J: Well, he served...he was sheriff at one time wasn't he?

NN: yeah. Well and his..let's see, you know Miss Reams that owns uh..well, her father was sheriff too. Remember, it was all in the Chambers family for quite awhile. Because they run the whole shebang thing. They grew and got the thing going and everything and see, he was the one too, get people to come in here just like John Nenni, he would have stayed here if John...if Dan hadn't took the interest in him. Dan took the interest in him and showed him said well "Her i'm gonna let you have that building over there and..." said "if you'll make the payments and you get straightened up and I'll show you what to do and this and that and you come to the bank if you have any questions or anything you want to find out, anything you just come to us and we'll help you work this out.

J: NOw, this is your father-in-law you're talkin' about?

NN: My father-in-law. My father-in-law. THAt's how he got started. It was through Dan Chambers because they started...start you out in this place and that's the way my husband did the same thing so they always carried your notes and as long as you did your duties you're makin' it fine. You won't have any problems. If you do what's right of course so the town always did...they always made money here in this town. Always was money and now it's been the worst it's ever been since these floods. THey ruined the place because you look at the people have left. Every time we have a flood, there's a big bunch of people leave and it's disgusting and they take their kids away from here and the schools are goin down and the towns are goin down and it's pitiful and...and it just makes you sick you know, people can't stand it around here when they see a town go down. Somebody has to keep them goin. Keep...keep the spirits here so that the whole thing won't go down. Now, if we get this up here and get his all fixed an everything, this will be a booming place. There...there claimed they're gonna build it up now twenty-five feet up here it's gonna be wonderful.

J: Some people...

NN: get the houses built and everything.

J: Some people have told me that you used to be I guess, big maple trees linin...

NN: Yeah. They did.

J: Main Street out here.

NN: Beautiful. THey were beautiful when I came here. Lower end of town where I lived, it was beautiful. We had the prettiest trees, grass, and everything was clean and we kept the garbage up and we kind of...we kind of trained a lot of them you know, to start pickin' up and doin' and this and that and if you don't train people, you'll never get it done. Never get the things done and when I was...when Eddie was in...little, I used to go to school. I took active part in PTA. Woman Club. I did all that when my husband was workin' cause he wanted me to do it. I had...had an active part in everything and I...I loved it. I love people. love people. And I love to help people.

J: How bout the fair. Did you get involved in organizing the fair?

NN: Well, we had that...well yeah, my husband helped you know, Reverend Kennedy's one and my husband's one that was...he was the president of the rotary then when...when it started and...

J; Tillio was?

NN: Tillio was. He was president of the Rotary Club and REverend Kennedy over here at the Methodist church, they all worked together and the Rotary Club and that's when they started the fair was during those times and they would go up there on Sunday and do all the work at the fair and build those tents. Now they have to pay people to go up there and do it. WHy, Tillio and all them, they went up there and did it theirself for free.

J; Um-hum.

NN: Now, they have to pay them every time they take...if they work behind those counters up there, they got to pay them. Why, they never paid none of us. We didn't take no money. For nothing. We put money in it and we went up there. I don't know how much we put in it. Advertisements and he...one time he...we had an advertisement up there but this I think this overhaul was about ten foot high, you know, up there and you guessed how many yards or something that was in it. We had that up at the fair for the Nenni's store. We had all kinds of stuff that we did all the time up there. On our own and we paid for everything and we helped the fair. We put money in it and uh...but lot of these now, everyth ing's up there now, everybody got to put money out for it. THat's no good. That doesn't build a town. That doesn't help the town either. They...everybody should do their share as charity for the town to keep it going and that's what we did. My husband was always in all that and he was the...he was a mason too and uh...and he did things in that...he did things all over the town. He was always doin' something. I think that's why he got sick too much...too much.

J: Runnin' too hard.

NN: He kept to goin too much all the time and uh...but he was just brought up like that and he couldn't stop. He needed somebody more experienced than me to see what was..he was headin' for the barn. YOu know.

J: Could he ever relax?

NN: NO, he couldn't. And then, when you did get him to relax, he didn't want to do nothing see, he just couldn't get hisself back up on himself cause those nerves had the best of him. That's, he would get them worked up so and then, he wouldn't tell me anything, he'd wait 'til I go to sleep then he'd wake up and stay up all night and smoke and in the morning I'd get up, them ashtrays was about that full. Nerves, smokin' all night. I could see that he was sick when I got up. I said "Why didn't you call me last night?" He said "Well, you was sleepin' so good, I hated to wake you up." Said "If I was sleepin' that good, I'd shoot them if they'd wake me up." He said junk like that you know. I'd get tickled at them. (laughing) but that was his nature. He was a Leo, you know what a Leo is don't you? There just one of them kinds you can't stop them.

J: Hard drivin'.

NN: See, I'm an Aquarius and I'm kind of quiet you know, I was kind of quiet and I would just observe and i'd do things like that but I wouldn't do the things he'd do because he was a leader, I mean a real leader and he wanted things done the way they's supposed to be done.

J: Um-hum/

NN: So, well, can you think of anything else that I didn't hit on?

J: Well, yeah. THere's a couple things.

NN: Okay.

J: Um...What was it like raisin a couple of children in Matewan?

NN: Well, it was wonderful back then. They had good schools, good teachers, and I took active part in everything and I was up the school all the time trying to help the teachers in any way, do anything or for my kids and or...or...an I took charge of like the PTA and stuff like that and I helped the teachers out with all that cause I wanted to be close to my kids. I want them to have a good education and they had all teachers up here that all had degrees back in them days and that was...that was very unusual cause Williamson school didn't have it that good.

J; Um-hum.

NN: They all had big degrees up here and Mr. Gose was the principal up here and he really ran a nice school and listen, we didn't have no trouble out of our kids either cause I know when Eddie was little, he'd come home and we had these little buttons on their little pants back then. THey'd button. The kind they wore to school you know. EVeryday, he'd come home, his pants, he was holding them in his hands, they were tore off him so I went up to the school and I talked to Mr. Gose about it and I told him I said "Mr. Gose..." I said, "There's something goin on up here. There's a fight or something..." I said "Eddie comes home every day all his clothes are tore off him." He said, "I tell you what you do tomorrow, you...you wait till Eddie leaves the house..." cause they come home for lunch everyday then, see, they walked home to eat their lunch. said "You wait 'til he leaves the house..." said "you get in the car and you follow him and you see what their doin'." So, you know what I did, I follered them and you know what they were doin', gettin'' in gang fights and they was tearin' each others clothes off each other so Mr. Gose took them all in the office and gave them a nice little paddling, each one of them, and boy, we never heard nothin' no more. That was the nicest bunch of kids you ever saw. (laughing)

J: NOw were these...

NN: THat was in grade school.

J: Kids from different neighborhoods? Is that what was goin on?

NN: yeah. Yeah. From all towns. Bus kids or whatever any ones that was there and Eddie ran around with. There's about ten or twelve of them. They all got a spanking. We never heard no more of that and so they straightened up. THey straightened up the whole bunch. So why, we were always tryin' to correct things, you know, tryin' to make better kids out of them.

J: What else did kids do? Did the circus ever come to town?

NN: yeah, We had a circus her once in awhile. They would come here and we would have that up...up the. (tape cuts off)

NN: Kids to Williamson mostly for circuses. ONce in awhile we'd have something up here but we had to take them to Williamson and we had to take them to the Williamson swimming pool. Now that...now that Matewan's got their swimming pool, everybody's got one in there yard. Now they can't do no business up there. Now what do you think about that?

J: did the kids...did they ever swim in the river or was that something...

NN: Yeah, they would go in the river but uh...well, they fish on the river, yeah, back then it was clean. You could do it. Yeah, they all...they live down this river out here. THey went down to the river and they'd swim out there and fish and everything. They always did do that. My husband always talked about that, too. He lived on the river. He loved that. He knew every...every part of the river out there.

J: Did he fisH?

NN: Oh yeah. Well no. He never did fish. He never did like to fish. He just strictly business man. He didn't know how to play. That was his problem. That's what the...Doctor Kim told me up at Radford. That was his biggest problem. That he never knew how to play because he wudn't brought up with play, he was brought up with work. Just work...work..work all the time. His family, they needed the money to eat. They couldn't play and his daddy bought him a bicycle at one time then he took it away from him. A beat up one and he finally ended up taking it away from him cause it was interfering with his work. So he was plain work. THat's what caused his nervous breakdown.

J: THat was sort of ingrained in him...

NN: That's what Dr. Kin said. That's what Dr, Kim said. He said he had never learned to relax and play like a kid. He didn't have that. He didn't have that.

J: Um-hum.

NN: ANd of course I think we had more love in our home than they did in there's cause they were different nationalities...you know, like I told you, different town. We had more love and more stickin' together in our family and we,...we helped each other more than they did. THey didn't...they were little bit more distant than we were but...

J: Different personalities in that area then?

NN: Yeah. OUr things were different. Yeah. THey were different. Yeah. Because they came from a different part of Italy and their habits were different too. All together and they cooked different than we did too. THey cooked different and uh...I...my grand...my mother in law uh...my husband you know, I was afraid maybe I couldn't cook to please them because they were from a different part of Italy you know said uh...He said to me he said "don't worry about that." he said, "My mother can't cook." he said "because she was an orphan and her sister raised her" See, she was an orphan, Mrs. Nenni was and she never did know...really learn to cook.

J: UN-hun.

NN: And he said "Don't worry about it. Anything you fix, I'll love it." he said "because you cook good and you know how to cook spaghetti and meat balls and this and that and all that junk you know and I said "Well, I was just worried that maybe I couldn't please you." (laughing)

J: So your father-in-law like your cooking too?

NN" Yeah. THey all like it. They come Sunday and eat with us and everything. THey always liked to come to our house.

J: YOu made all this from scratch?

NN: Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. You have to. You had to back in those days.

J: Where'd you do your grocery shopping and marketing?

NN: Let's see, I'm trying to think that now, well we...mostly my daddy went to the wholesale house. They went to whole sale houses in Williamson and the would buy everything wholesale see.

J: Un-hun.

NN: Armours course it wasn't Armours there. I can't remember the name of the place cause I was just a little kid but I can remember that when we bought things it was you know, a whole thing of cheese, a whole thing of salami and a whole thing. Just everything in big pieces like that because they had all those borders and they had to because they packed lunches see. They packed punches in those days and they bought beans and flour and everything by the barrels back in those days. They bought everything like that in that store in the grocery store they had and uh...they would everything was in big quantities.

J: Did you have a truck that you'd carry stuff in?

NN: Yeah, We had a truck. They,...they delivered too. THey delivered and then my daddy....my daddy delivered and my great great uncle, they delivered on those trucks..on those...they had horses and they had the stable down there at Williamson. You know where the Hankins Ice used to be? Well, down there where they bought our house down in there, that's where we lived. THat's our house...our property that they bought down in there.

J: Un-hun.

NN: Goin up to Hankins Ice well, the stable were down...down in there and uh...and MIngo Motor Company, that was the Whites, Guy White and all them, they had the...they sold Ford...T-Fords down in there. It was a big garage place down in there you know, and you pull up over there and you go around that place, when you go down in..in there, well, that's where the MIngo Motor was. THe WHite family owned all that. ANd some way, they were kin to the CHambers some way. I don't know. I heard later. I didn't know that 'til years later but they were all connected you know, one was connected with the other but they were real nice people. We had a real nice place down.

J: I'll ask you one more question..

NN: Okay.

J: You've mentioned something about the seventy-seven flood,

NN: Yeah.

J: Can you just outline...

NN: Just go back to it?

J: Just what happened then. Un-hun. THe events of the flood.

NN: Let me try to think now, well, we knew the water was comin' but we didn't know how bad. We knew it was raisin and we called up McDowell. That's usually where we got the flood. We'd get it from McDowell see, cause, when it rains up there, that's when we get it see, we get it bad here and so we called up there and we noticed it was raisin. It was raisin and there was no stops to we started...

J: Who did you call? Call radio station?

NN: my...no it was my sister had a restaurant up there in uh...you know where...you know where that emergency hospital is?

J: um?

NN: Have you ever been to Welch? Well, she had...she has a buildin' up there and she would let us know what was goin on all the time and uh...so and we'd keep in touch with here because she'd...she'd tell us exactly what was goin on and that was exactly hit. WHat she told you, so much is comin' down you all's way and all that you know and so we kept up with it and with that and so then, I told Eddie, I said "We better start gettin' some garbage bags and start gettin' some things together, I said "because if we don't were not gonna make it." But we didn't make it anyway. We didn't save nothin. So then we finally...the water came in and we just lost everything and Eddie stayed here and I had to take his daddy off. That was about...that was about the extent and I was down at the house though, puttin' the stuff in the house. Usually, that second floor saved everything we had. We always put it on the second floor and up in the attic and we saved all our furniture but that...we...I had gotten everything up there that day and uh....and I had come out of the house without nothin' but an old house coat on and an old beat up pair of shoes...houseshoes I had on. I wudn't even dressed to come out of that place and I had left...get out cause water was comin' and uh...

J: Were you there by yourself?

NN: Yeah...I was there and uh...and Eddie...Eddie would come every once in awhile but he was up here busy with this stuff.

J; Un-hun.

NN: ANd he got caught in a current up here and he couldn't come down. THe current got caught back here and it rolled him. It was about to take him down the river. He was out there swimming in it. LAte...got our here too late. He opened that door too late and he couldn't hardly get out and he had a time but he made it and so, I had to go down his house. I had a bunch of food packed and everything and I thought, well, it might not be too bad, you know, I usually go down Eddie's and stay two or three days and then come back up to the house and start puttin' stuff back together. WEll, we went down there and the more we stayed, we went up and stayed with the Hatfields on top the hill there uh...I can't think of his name they...his boys has got a car place in Columbus now. Uh...we stayed with them about two weeks on that hill and uh...they got free food and cases of eggs and bread and different Hub Cline and different people would stop by and give us food.

J: Was this comin' in from the Red Cross?

NN: Yeah. Red Cross and they would bring it in to us cause we couldn't get no food no place so we stayed on that hill for two weeks and so after two weeks, it got up in my car too, and we couldn't even travel so we had to get the car worked on so we could get into Columbus with Tilie cause he was gettin' a nervous breakdown cause he forgot his pills and left them in the house and didn't even have his medication so we...we stayed on that hill for two weeks with him with no medication but we and he was gettin' worse all the time so finally, um...we got help up there and somebody fixed our car. Eddie took the car to the garage and had to have it warshed out. THe motor and everything and we finally made it to Huntington to Tilie's sister. SHe lives in...Rose, in Huntington and we stayed with her, I think we stayed a week with her because I...I had to take Tilie to the doctor and we... and then I had lost my teeth. I left my teeth in the house and I had to have me some teeth made in Huntington.

J; un-hun.

NN: ANd she took me around and uh...to some of her friends and they...they...they took up collection or something. I had to go buy me some under clothes and I didn't have nothing. SHe took me to the wholesale house and I got me a couple...two or three dresses in that wholesale house down there and uh...so then, finally, we uh...we had to get Tillie to...up to Columbus and I told..took Tillie to Columbus and when I got down there, we had to buy quite a few clothes down there and I wrote some checks down there and my daughter, they got them cashed at the bank for me and we went downtown and got him some pajamas and some pants and some shoes and different things down in town and of course then I'd got a check from the government. THey sent me a check for five thousand, whether it was the old people or something, I don't know what the...something there that they gave the people that was in the flood so I took that money and bought the clothes and everything that I needed and everything down in the Huntington and I got...we got to Columbus...we got to Columbus, we put Tillie into the...in to the...the hospital down there and then Eddie start workin' on his store and that's...then we got the carpenters in. They come in from Charleston, I think, a bunch of them come in...they...they come in here from Charleston and they were workin' at Browns in William son and they said, right after they got Brown's finished, they were gonna start on us.

J; ANd you got SBA help?

NN: And SBA. We went to the...yeah, we went to the Red Cross. We did all that before we went to Columbus down in Williamson. Went there then we got the SBA and they said they'd set us up a loan on a three percent loan and uh...we got that three percent loan and uh...then we started...has to start orderin' merchandise and we started merchandise and then...start gettin' busy workin' again and do what we had to do. Tryin' to get back to normal as fast as we could and we did. We got back in here in October then and we had all the merchandise in here and all the shelf's fixed all...painted. They was beautiful. Tillie just fell in love with the place. He really fell in love with it once he...

J: ONce you finally got him back here he was glad he came.

NN: He was tickled to death to be back and tickled that we had it set up and he said, "Well, how we gonna fill this place up with merchandise,. We ain't got no money." I said, "Don't worry about it. The SBA's gonna loan it to us." He said, "My God, here we go again." (laughing) And I said, "Well, Tillie, you got to live somewhere. You got to have..make a living someplace. WE got to do it." I said, and i said "I can work. Eddie can work. We can hire people. We can do it. We can manage and don't worry about it." So he got in here and he'd start doin' little things and he enjoyed it and he loved it and after we got him all wrapped up and then he just loved it. I tell you, I couldn't believe that he...he would get so wrapped up and lose hisself again then he forgot about his sickness see and we got him going again and then we got back in here and then we've been here since then. So, we been in plenty floods here though to...to go through it and the SBA said "Well, how to order this and how to do this and how to do"...I said "Well, we been in it since 1937. We ought to know something." I said, "Take our word for it. (laughing)

J: How long then, did Mr. Nenni live after you opened up again.

NN: 1980. He died. He had a ...he had a heart attack is what it was. He had a heart attack and died, 1980 so, it was December the nineteenth, right before Christmas. It was a terrible CHristmas.

J; I guess.

NN: We'll never forget it...

J: That concludes this interview.

Matewan Oral History Project Collection